Evangelical Christian spokesman Richard Cizik’s willingness to talk about everything from global warming to gay rights has made him the darling of many in that community who hope to expand the evangelical political agenda beyond opposition to abortion and gay marriage. But Cizik’s recent comments in an NPR interview that he was re-evaluating his position on civil unions for homosexuals got him demoted from his leadership position with the National Association of Evangelicals last week. But what about Cizik’s point? Do you think there’s any scriptural support for the idea of same sex civil unions? Â Or does it even matter if there is? Should the idea of marriage as civil contract be divorced, no pun intended, from the idea of marriage as a religious ceremony and belief?
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 Dr. B. J. Bogard –  Biblical Literature Professor
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I just returned from a Torah study session during which an interesting issue was discussed with my Rabbi:  would he, a member of the Conservative Jewish Rabbinate, officiate at wedding ceremony between a Lesbian or Gay couple? The Rabbi thought for a moment and—in a traditional Jewish manner—responded that he would do so but only if he felt that the marriage would result in “holiness,†only if the resulting marriage seemed to indicated a desire to create a “center of consecration.â€
Of course, those who oppose Gay marriage will find his answer unacceptable. Rather, religious traditionalists and conservatives will argue that   marriage is only possible between one man and one woman. They will maintain that history and tradition has always accepted only heterosexual marriages—conveniently forgetting that history   has supported slavery, Jim Crow laws, polygamy, sodomy laws and far too many laws and prohibitions that a modern society has long abandoned. They will maintain that the Bible specifically opposes Homosexuality—conveniently forgetting that the Bible condemns mixing meat and milk at the same meal, working on the Sabbath or urges stoning children who fail to follow their father’s wishes. They may insist that the purpose of marriage is a legal framework for procreation, and that since Gays and Lesbian can’t bring children into this world, the state has no interest in supporting such marriage—conveniently forgetting that older or infertile couples have always been able to marry.  I remarried late in life after my wife’s death and no one questioned whether we would have more children.  Church law may accept such historical, traditional and Biblical injunctions, but a modern secular state must—I believe—base their laws on a more meaningful basis.
So what did my Rabbi mean when he suggested that he would participate and support a homosexual marriage if such a relationship produced “Holiness.â€Â First, what it is not: sexuality, apart from commitment and love, is not holiness; sexuality apart  from a desire to bring compassion, understanding, and sensitivity is not holiness; passion, separated from long-term desire to share fulfillment and joy and pain and weakness with the other,  is not holiness. Holiness in a relationship, on the other hand, is the joint aspiration to bring Tikkun Olam, the “fixing of the broken world†of action and faith, within the relationship. Holiness in a marriage is the commitment between two people who wish to bring “G-d,†the infinite power of love and healing, into a relationship. He would probably, as have other Rabbis, define G-d as the space between two people in a loving relationship; he would probably assume that his blessing at the wedding represented an empowering agent of healing, a consecration of the Tikkun and giving of renewed life. Â
Clearly, of course, my Rabbi came to this conclusion with “fear and trembling.â€Â He admitted that early in his career he would have opposed Gay marriage, but upon reflection and maturity he changed his position. He clearly was still wrestling with the conflict between tradition and ethics. Of course he realized that traditional Judaism opposed both Gay marriage and a Gay Rabbinate. But he could no longer, he maintained, deny a Gay or Lesbian couple who only wanted a religious blessing upon what is offered to heterosexuals merely because they shared sexual love differently. And what he said today thrilled me: my Rabbi reflected the core of dynamic Judaism, the desire to transcend rigidity in the face of modern contextual complexity, to wrestle with the tradition yet remain at the leading edge of liberating the oppressed, the marginalized, and the rejected—to listen attentively to our ancient texts but build a world of equality and justice. Quite a difficult and tenuous balancing act. Abraham Joshua Heschel would have been proud of this Rabbi.    Â
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Rev. Brian Carpenter- Presbyterian Church in America
The only way to find scriptural support for homosexuality or homosexual unions is to engage in gross eisegesis (reading or placing ideas into the scriptures) rather than exegesis (drawing ideas out of the scriptures.) Jesus was very clear in Mark 10:6-9 that God had a creative intent in making male and female, and it was for marriage. The Bible is crystal clear in both the Old and New Testaments that homosexual behavior is a sin. Those who point out that Jesus never specifically addressed homosexuality in his earthly ministry are not thinking very straight, or have a defective view of Jesus Christ. He didn’t specifically address beastiality, rape, usury, idolatry, respect for parents, theft, drunkenness or drug abuse either. Shall we conclude that he was in favor of those things or that they weren’t important? Jesus taught as if he took for granted that the scriptures were authoritative, and when they are properly understood we see that he never contradicted them. All orthodox Christians (Protestant, Catholic, or Eastern Orthodox) believe Jesus Christ existed before the Incarnation and was active in the giving of the Hebrew Scriptures. All orthodox Christians, (Protestant, Catholic, or Eastern Orthodox) believe he was present with the Church after the Ascension and instructed his Apostles as they wrote what became the New Testament. (John 16:12-13) If someone doesn’t believe that, that’s their right, of course. But why bother to call yourself Christian? There simply isn’t any scriptural legitimacy for any other way of doing it, whether the current cover of Newsweek says there is or not.
Gay activists have thrown tantrums all over the country because the voters of California overturned the gay marriage law. Nasty things have been said about Christians, Mormons, and African Americans. On the Colbert Report, one activist said he was quite happy that those of the older generation who were more conservative in their values didn’t have much longer to live. In Lansing, Michigan a group of homosexual terrorists took over a church in the middle of Sunday morning worship and trashed and desecrated it. Foul and blasphemous language was used in the presence of children. Two lesbians took over the pulpit and began kissing. This was not a church that was particularly vocally anti gay-rights. It was a vanilla non-denomination evangelical church. The pastor had just finished praying for Barack Obama when the obscenities began.
(http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=80743)
All of which, of course, the mainstream media ignored.
Gay activists regularly point out that heterosexual marriages are a mess. And so they are. And those sins are sins which are either forgiven by the grace of God or not, depending on the circumstances and the people involved. I will not excuse them. However, pointing out that somebody else is sinning doesn’t justify your own sinning.
I will concede that the gay rights activists have something of a point. I found that when I pastored a small-town church in the Presbyterian Church (U.S.A), my old denomination, that the Bible became very important when we were talking about gay marriage and gay ordination. It was significantly less important when the issue was a foul mouth, or tithing, or sleeping together apart from marriage, or paying all one’s income taxes, or one’s own unbiblical divorce, or if one wanted to skip church and play golf all summer. Cultural conservatism and the “ick” factor most heterosexuals feel when contemplating gay sex can often wrap themselves in Christianity, but they’re not the same thing as Christianity.
I am puzzled by this desire to find scriptural legitimacy for lawmaking in this country when we ignore the scriptures about everything from our monetary system to our foreign policy to our family policy. We simply pretend the scriptures don’t speak on those points. We aren’t even aware of what they say. Therefore it’s pretty hard to get very worked up about this particular issue when so many other dominos have already fallen. It’s just another step along the path to the complete cultural, philosophical, spiritual, and moral collapse of Western Civilization. Unless God does a mighty work and sends true revival on our land, beginning with the Church, then the decline is probably irreversible. So that’s what I pray and preach and labor for. Anything else is just the proverbial finger in the leaky dike (no pun intended.)
Don Jones - Buddhist
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I did a Wikepedia search on Christian denominations and the initial result came up with the quote of approximately 35,000 different world-wide denominations.  Just how and when these branched off from the original church is an education all by itself but it shows that people want to worship the way they want to.  They have a vision of who they are as a culture, community and their individual personalities.  There came a point in my own spiritual growth where Christianity no longer fit the bill.  I didn’t have any desire to change the existing Church or argue scripture with any hierarchy or start a new church.  I just found a faith that suited me.  Isn’t the goal here just to become better, more loving people?  Why does any official church authority feel the need to constantly re-arrange and interpret scripture to either include or exclude  ”those people”
I am not gay, but being in the arts all my life has exposed me to many, and I count friends in that camp. Â I do know one thing that is true about them: Being gay is not a choice. Â It is something that you know you are at some point in your life and you have to deal with it. Â A common feeling among gays is an early history of self-loathing and helplessness. Â It is my choice not to condemn these folks under any scripture or standard and to love them for who they are. Â Their struggles in society are many and many mistakes and bad decisions have been made. Â I do not defend behavior such as Brian outlined above. Â But what are we to do? To simply state that they are all sinners and act accordingly with punitive and prejudicial policies will not solve the problem and will not convert a single gay into a straight person. Â There are and will be gay Christians, Muslims, Jews, and Buddhists and there is nothing you or anyone can do about it.
As far as the collapse of Western civilization goes: I think that if the majority of it collapses - good riddance. Â Our arrogance regarding the superiority of this culture is just simple prejudice and sometimes ignorance and xenophobia. Â Brian is absolutely correct when he states: “I am puzzled by this desire to find scriptural legitimacy for lawmaking in this country when we ignore the scriptures about everything from our monetary system to our foreign policy to our family policy.” Â This goes back to the question about vetting political candidates according to their religion. Â When and where are we to put these moral teachings to work?
 Who decides which God is the true God?  How is it that all “others” are going to hell except “us”? These questions never end and never go away.  You want to start pointing fingers at others and label them sinners; watch out! A finger will point your way too.
Merry Christmas BTW!!!
 Father Thomas Williams - St. John’s Orthodox Church
The Bible and human history begin and end with weddings. Adam and Eve came together in marital union in Paradise before the Fall, revealing marriage as a part of God’s eternal purpose for humanity in the midst of Creation (Gen. 2: 22-25). History closes with the marriage of the Bride to the Lamb (Rev. 19:7-9), earthly marriage being fulfilled in the heavenly, showing the eternal nature of the sacrament.
Between these bookend events of history are numerous accounts of the union of men and women. In the centuries -old wedding ceremony used to this day in the Orthodox Church, several of these historic marriages are remembered: Abraham and Sarah (Gen 11:29-23:20); (Isaac and Rebecca (Gen. 24); Joachim and Anna, the parents of the Virgin Mary, and Zacharias and Elizabeth, the parents of St. John the Baptist, (Luke 1:5-58).
The marriage most prominently mentioned in the Orthodox wedding ceremony, however, is the one at Cana in Galilee (John 2; 1-11). In attending this wedding and performing His first public miracle there, Our Holy Lord Jesus Christ sanctified marriage. As with all Christian sacraments, marriage is sacramental because it is blessed by God. Thus it is holy, blessed and everlasting in the sight of God and His Church. Within the bonds of marriage a man and a woman experience an eternal union with one another in love, with the husband as the icon of Christ and the wife as the icon of the Church, and, if it be God’s will, they experience the holy fruit of children, and, one day, the joy of grandchildren.Â
Thus Orthodox Christianity holds in high regard the God-ordained institution of marriage and the family. The Orthodox Church has always affirmed that marriage is the union of one man and one woman given by God to one another for mutual support, encouragement, love and and the holy fruit of children.
Dr. Nicholas Wallerstein–religious studies professor
I think it is very important to this debate that the Reverend Carpenter mentions the current cover story of Newsweek, in which journalist Lisa Miller gives her scriptural arguments in defense of gay marriage (“The Religious Case for Gay Marriage,†Dec. 15, 2008). Allow me to make a few points. First, Ms. Miller states “while the Bible and Jesus say many things about love and family, neither explicitly defines marriage as between one man and one woman.†Of course neither explicitly defines marriage between a man and a woman because this would have been completely unnecessary. The idea of marriage between men or between women would have been considered utterly absurd, unthinkable, and impossible.
Second, Ms. Miller defends gay marriage by pointing out that “the Bible doesn’t give abundant examples of traditional [heterosexual] marriage.†This is again absurd. The Bible does give abundant examples of heterosexual marriage: literally every single one of the hundreds or thousands of marriages found or mentioned in the Bible is heterosexual—even the polygamist marriages. Solomon had 700 spouses, yes, but they were all female!
Third, in her most egregious defense of gay marriage, Ms. Miller quotes a Biblical passage in which King David tears his clothes when Jonathan dies and says “Your love for me was wonderful, / More wonderful than the love of women.†Ms. Miller’s comment is the following: “Here, the Bible praises enduring love between men. What Jonathan and David did or did not do in privacy is perhaps best left to history and our imagination.†Not only is Miller’s implication disgusting, but it is inaccurate. The fact is that many ancient Mediterranean cultures, including Greek and Roman culture, believed that the spiritual love between men was superior to the fleshly love between men and women. To imply that the spiritual love between King David and Jonathan was actually homosexual lust culminating in sodomy is to desecrate the Bible and to misrepresent the history of ancient Mediterranean culture all at the same time.
These are only a few of the bizarre arguments Ms. Miller puts forth. I recommend that the discerning reader of this blog read the entire Newsweek article, for it is a harbinger of the arguments that will be used in the assault against the traditional marriage of male and female.
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